Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I was in the army.... used to hunt as a child, but I am not a gun expert.

What is the ideal firearm for personal protection?

Not looking for super expensive gun. I want something with readily available ammo, and a decent price tag. PLEASE ADVISE. thank you

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Before you get flooded with input, my 2 Cu plated Zn disc's worth is a snub nosed 38.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=110821389

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Since you said personal protection, I assume you are looking for a concealable pistol and not a shotgun (which would be ideal for home defense) or a rifle.

My personal favorite is the Glock 19 chambered in 9mm. I like 9mm because it's big enough to have some stopping power but not so big that it's hard to handle (I'm a little guy and I have flinching problems anyway with the larger calibers). I love Glocks because they're ultra-reliable (like the AK-47, Glocks will fire with sand in them) and I also appreciate the lack of an external manual safety because it forces me to have good gun handling habits (because there is no manual safety to rely on).

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Simple, small 2 in snub nosed revolver in 38 spl. Want the lowest cost but very good quality revolver.......get a Charter Arms......under $250 new.

I prefer 5 shot revolvers for smaller cylinder diameter. Get aluminum alloy frame. Get either hammerless or shrouded hammer.

Shoot 38 special +P.....nothing more....no +P+......too much for shuch a small barrel length....all you get is more flash and noise......do not need a .357.....way too much flash and bang....you will be night blind and deaf in a night gun fight.....just stick to 38 spl....or 38 spl +P.

Small. Powerful. Reliable. Simple. Inexpensive.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I concur with the above statement.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Personal protection from/for what?

Answer that question and then you will know if you are looking for a pistol, rifle or shotgun.

I prefer the three gun solution (all of the above) but since you mentioned "ideal firearm" (singular), refer to above question.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

What were you trained with in the Army? Use that,Regards,Mike

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Read some of the other threads...

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Easy, get a stainless steel .357 revolver with a 4 inch barrel. Easy to teach to others, you can feed it cheap .38 special reloads to practice with and load it up with +p .357 to kill deer or shoot through cars if need be.
Spend a little money to put crimson trace laser grips on it later if you want.
The model 686 SW and others just like it are probably the best handguns in the world.
There is a reason revolvers have been around since 1836. :smokin:

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I think the ideal firearm would be an invisible gun.
Invisibility would offer a clear advantage to a guy with an invisible gun.
And if the guy carrying the invisible gun was also invisible himself then he would be awesome!

But then, as I've been told by a few friends, I think invisibility is the answer to everything.
They are fools for fighting invisibilty! :banghead:

But think about it... an invisible gun.

The bullets probably wouldn't have to be invisible, though, because, you know, that might be going too far and I doubt the technology is there yet.. :smokin:

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

My Ideal firearm.....

[URL=http://imageshack.us]http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/9...cafh5raog6.jpg[/

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

My input
Most versatile weapons for the novice: Mini 14 or AK 47.
Best compact: Smith & Wesson snubnose 38, Airweight or stainless.
Shotgun: HK Benelli (8 shot)
Side arm: 1911 long slide variant or Itallian Beretta 92F
My most enjoyable to shoot: 1911 long slide, early Colt Python 6" royal blue, and Ruger Redhawk 44 magnum 7 1/4" barrel
Best plinker: Ruger 10/22
(All these weapons should be tweaked, modified and have actions polished to your spec.) (exception is the early colt...these had a glass smooth action.)

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I guess it depends on what you need it for and your budget.

Cant go wrong with a glock 19 for handguns, though.

get one of these holsters

http://smartcarry.com/

and you will be all set. I can wear a t-shirt and a pair of gym shorts, and still have my glock and a spare mag on me anywhere I go.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I second that! Just for self or home defense close in, go with the Glock. More rounds to defend with, plus very quick reload. No messing around with speed loaders while stress firing. They are easy to learn if you've ever used a semi-auto handgun. 1911 was the first real handgun I ever shot or carried when I was in the Navy. Guess they switched to something in a 9mm now. 9mm ammo is probably one of the most reasonable centerfire ammo you can buy. Since you'll only asking for advice on one gun, get the Glock, because you probable won't be reloading for just one gun, you don't need to worry about saving brass.

I like to also advise on getting a pump shotgun, either a bolt deer rifle or a SKS, AR, or AK to fill the rifle need and of course, get a Ruger 10/22 for plinking and hunting small game. A .22 revolver is real nice to have around if you have any land and want to have something cheap to shoot and keep handy when out and about.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

No,....P- Phased Pistol in 75 Watt/3.6 Megajoules Range

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Why not skip the low caliber stuff and try a pistol that shoots .825 G&S?

http://www.chuckhawks.com/825_magnum.htm


The NEW .825 G&S Online Express Magnum
By the Guns and Shooting Online Staff


http://www.chuckhawks.com/825_express_mag.jpgFrom left: .44 Mag, .825 Std, .825 Premium, .357 Mag.Given the dearth of new big bore hunting pistol cartridges in recent years, we at Guns and Shooting Online felt that it was time that we became proactive in order to jump start the market. Wimpy efforts such as the .475 Linebaugh and .500 S&W may be okay for mouse guns and girley men, but real men need a new cartridge into which we can sink our teeth.
Our cartridge design team spent months surveying the market and concluded that the new cartridge should be between .800 and .850 caliber. This is because big game has, undeniably, become progressively harder to kill during the last century.
Perhaps a brief handgun cartridge history can best illustrate the point. From the last quarter of the 19th Century through the first quarter of the 20th Century, standard revolver cartridges such as the .45 Long Colt (the "world's most powerful revolver cartridge" at that time) and the relatively flat shooting .38 Special High Speed (loaded to maximum average pressures--MAP--up to about 20,000 psi) were considered to be all that was required for any handgun purpose afield. However, by the mid-1920s game had gotten harder to kill and the standard velocity handgun cartridges were no longer sufficient for the task, even at very close range.
The first magnum handgun cartridge, the .357 Magnum, was therefore introduced in 1935 to shift the balance of power back to the handgun hunter. For at time, it did. At the time of its introduction the .357, loaded to the previously unheard of (for a handgun) MAP of about 43,000 psi, was the most powerful handgun cartridge in the world. It was loaded with a 158 grain bullet at a muzzle velocity (MV) of 1550 fps and muzzle energy (ME) of 845 ft. lbs. The .357 was used to bag all North American big game, including elk, moose and the great bears, before the beginning of the Second World War. Big game was still relatively weak in that bygone era, so practically no one felt any need for a more powerful handgun hunting cartridge.
However, by the end of World War II wild game was becoming too tough for the .357 Magnum. Elk and moose were becoming impervious even to perfectly placed .357" bullets. (Today, of course, we all know that even the smallest deer have become completely immune to .357 Magnum bullets.) Experiments to again redress the balance of killing power were underway in earnest by 1950 and in 1956 the result, the .44 Remington Magnum, was born.
This new cartridge, billed as the world's most powerful handgun cartridge, was standardized at a MAP of 36,000 psi. The original loads drove a 240 grain bullet at a MV of 1470 fps with ME of 1150 ft. lbs. The .44 Mag. was used to kill all manner of heavy game such as elk, moose, the great bears and it did so with authority. All across North America hunters heaved sighs of relief. Protected by a .44 Magnum revolver, it was once again safe to venture into the woods.
Unfortunately, that happy state of affairs only lasted until the 1970s. By that time elk and moose had begun to shrug off solid hits by .429" (.44 Mag.) bullets. In desperation, some handgun hunters began carrying crystals for protection in the field and storing their .44 Magnum ammunition inside pyramids specially constructed for the purpose. (A secondary benefit of the latter practice came to light when it was discovered that these pyramid shapes also sharpened razor blades.)
Others sought safety in the magic properties of the .45 caliber bullet and traditional .45 Long Colt cartridge, loaded to pressures far in excess of the SAAMI standardized 14,000 psi. Cultists, of course, have long recognized the .45 as possessing killing power completely out of proportion to the scientific reality of its cross-sectional area, sectional density and available kinetic energy. Wildlife had the last laugh, however, as the inevitable results of such experiments were far more missing fingers and blown-up revolvers than injured animals.
A stop gap measure was Dick Casull's .454 Casull revolver cartridge, a sort of super Long Colt, introduced as the most powerful revolver cartridge in the world. Markedly more powerful than the .44 Magnum, the .454 drove up to a 300 grain bullet at a MV of 1650 fps and ME of 1478 ft. lbs. The .454 brought temporary relief during the 1980s. However, by the time of its standardization by SAAMI in 1998 at a MAP of 65,000 psi, big game animals had already become too tough to be killed by mere .454" bullets.
John Linebaugh stepped up to the plate with his .475 Linebaugh, the "worlds most powerful revolver cartridge" of the 1990s. Offering a modest increase in killing power over the .454 Casull, the .475 Linebaugh drives its heavier 400 grain bullet at a MV of 1300 fps with ME of 1501 ft. lbs. However, the .475 Linebaugh is a cartridge whose time has already come and gone.
By the turn of the 21st Century, the .475 Linebaugh was no longer sufficient to kill, or even dissuade, heavy North American game. In an effort to bolster their tattered corporate image (and financial bottom line), Smith & Wesson courageously offered up their .500 S&W Magnum in 2003. This cartridge, for which a new, larger revolver had to be designed (sadly, based on the same antiquated S&W lock work), drives a 400 grain bullet at a MV of 1625 fps and ME of 2346 ft. lbs. It is pegged at a MAP of around 50,000 psi.
In 2005 a panicky Smith & Wesson introduced the higher velocity .460 S&W Magnum (300 grain bullet, MV 1750 fps, ME 2041 fps) on the same case to augment their .500, but the handwriting is already on the wall for the big S&W revolver cartridges: North American game is becoming immune to them!
As can clearly be seen from the forgoing history, the pace of big game indestructibility is quickening. It is no longer a secret that elk, shot by high power rifle bullets and once thought to be stone dead, are re-awakening. (A conspiracy by PETA and other animal rights groups may be responsible this; an undercover Guns and Shooting Online investigation into this possibility is underway.) The .30-06 rifle cartridge is now considered marginal for killing elk and is close to becoming totally inadequate. See Bruce Rutherford's interesting article "Adequate Elk Cartridges," which can be found on the Ammunition and Cartridge Articles index of the Rifle Information Page for more on this subject.
An increase in bore diameter of a lousy 0.01" to 0.05" is simply inadequate to keep pace with the rapidly accelerating indestructibility of big game animals. That is why, as a public service to our readers, Guns and Shooting Online has developed the .825 G&S Online Express Magnum cartridge. Proportionally similar to the .44 Remington Magnum in shape (see the approximately life size photo at the top of this article), the .825 could be described as a .44 Magnum on steroids--lots of steroids!
We at Guns and Shooting Online refuse to be victims of big game animal indestructibility! The .825 G&S Online Express Magnum, with an actual bullet diameter of .823", provides a realistic 0.323" increase in bore diameter to kill elk and other North American big game animals and keep them dead. This is the cartridge that separates the girley men from the real men.
The new .825 is based on a rimmed, straight sided case. Here are the .825's vital measurements:

• Bullet diameter - .823"
• Case material- "High tension" steel
• Maximum case length - 2.2105" (nominal case length 2.210")
• Rim diameter - 0.925"
• Rim thickness - 0.095"
• Head diameter - 0.865"
• Neck diameter - 0.860"
• Overall cartridge length - 2.850"
• Barrel twist - 1 turn in 18"
• Primer type - Large Rifle Magnum
• Maximum average pressure - 82,500 psi

All .825 cases are being made of what is known in the steel industry as high tension alloy (or mild) steel. Steel cases are required because the operating pressure of the new cartridge would melt brass cases.
The new 750 grain bullets developed specifically for the .825 G&S Online Express Magnum have ballistic coefficients of 0.180 and sectional densities of 0.158. One of these new bullets is a lead core fully-jacketed hollow point (JHP) design. The Premium bullet is a monolithic gilding metal hollow point (MHP) designed for deep penetration and virtually 100% weight retention in any creature up to and including a T-Rex.
There will be two initial .825 G&S Online Express Magnum loads. The "Standard" (or medium velocity) load will drive the 750 grain JHP bullet at a MV of 1280 fps for a ME of 2724 ft. lbs. It is hoped that this load will suffice for hunting the smaller species of deer. It can also serve as a mild practice load. This standard load can be recognized by its brass-plated case.
The "Premium," full power load drives the 750 grain MHP bullet at a MV of 1610 fps and ME of 4300 ft. lbs. This is power on a par with elephant rifle cartridges and it is hoped that the Premium .825 G&S Online Express Magnum load will serve to keep elk shot with it dead for years to come. The .825 Premium load can be recognized by its nickel-plated case. The ballistics of both loads were measured in a 10" vented test barrel.
Of course, a new, larger revolver is required in which to chamber the .825 G&S Online Magnum cartridge. It is far to large--and too powerful--for the puny Smith and Wesson "X" frame revolvers developed for the .460 and .500 S&W Magnum cartridges.
The Guns and Shooting Online Technical Department is developing an innovative new revolver based on the 9-lug Weatherby Mark V action. Despite certain minor pre-production snags, we hope to have a review of this new revolver available soon. The new revolvers, as well as factory loaded .825 Mag. ammunition, will be sold exclusively though the Guns and Shooting Online Store.
Preliminary testing of the new cartridge has been conducted using a single shot, closed-breech pistol with a 10" barrel and has yielded excellent accuracy results. 5-shot, 100 yard groups have averaged 0.2 MOA, with the largest groups measuring 0.5" and the smallest groups measuring 0.1", regardless of who on the Guns and Shooting Online staff has done the shooting. Seldom, outside of the pages of print magazines, has the shooting world seen such a consistently accurate cartridge.
Early on we were afraid that recoil might be an issue for some individuals, but this has not been the case. We consider the recoil to be "not unpleasant." We consulted Charles Atlas (through a medium) and he reported that the .825 pistol was "controllable." In any case, there are no wimps on the Guns and Shooting Online staff. Shooting the .825 Express magnum has been described as, "a piece of day-old cake." And comments like, "I can't wait to get this pesky cast off my hand so that I can shoot it again" were common.
Calculated recoil in our 5.25 pound test pistol amounts to only 92.9 ft. lbs. for the Standard (1280 fps) load and a somewhat more interesting 125.6 ft. lbs. for the Premium (1610 fps) load. We feel that any experienced handgunner with hair on his or her chest should be able to handle that level of recoil energy without complaint. After all, recoil is what puts the kick in shooting!
This, then, is the .825 G&S Online Express Magnum cartridge, the most powerful handgun cartridge in the world. Not available in stores.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

I knew you were the Terminator...:wink:

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Best gun is the one you have with you.

I'm looking to get a CZ 82 or 83 as my next handgun. Faster follow up shots and magazine capacity are worth more than "stopping power" to me, but I can't claim to know much about gunfights either.

My thought is: 5 out of 15 .32ACP is better than 1 out of 6 .45 or whatever.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

You ain't packing if you don't have one of these:


































































http://thebadplus.typepad.com/photos...eathstar_2.jpg


:D

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

:applause_:applause_:applause_

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Get a gun that is reliable and fits well in your hand(s). Something you will train with and not just sit in the safe. You mentioned the .mil. If you are well trained on the m-16 platform, then perhaps an AR is the way to go.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Any opinion on the Smith & Wesson .40 GVE?

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Owned one of the earlier Sigmas. Had a hellacious trigger pull...couldn't get it to shoot very well, even after having the trigger worked on. Traded it for a Glock...the rest is history.

Friends who run a local range say Sigmas are problematic.

The "Enhanced" versions may be somewhat better...though I doubt it.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

+ 1.....excellent advise

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Too many moving parts. I don't even want to think about taking it apart to clean it.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

just got this one last night with carring handle
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AT-DeltonA3 Del-Ton DTI-15 5.56x45/.223 M4 Carbinehttp://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Del-Ton_DTI-15_5.56_Carbine.html

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Well I really appreciate all the advice, and I took everything into consideration when I went to the local range/ gunstore yesterday. I shot a few weapons, and ended up buying the weapons below. I bought the XD because I want a good weapon for the concealed carry license I plan on getting, and I bought the .357 revolver so my girlfriend could use it, but I wanted the option of using different ammo.

Springfield XD .40 5"

S&W M60 357 3" Stainless HVZ

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Both are good choices...hope they work for you :wink:

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

The Springfield XD .40 is a very respectable choice. You'll be glad you got the 5". You do want to be able to hit something with the damn thing!

The M 60 ain't no slouch either...just a little large for conceal carry.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Mark 19 will do. With tactical "hip fire" system.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

Never, NEVER ask a group of gun collectors to recommend just one gun! Even asking one person at a time will get you more advice than you can handle.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

You got that right.

Get one of my best buddies started talking about guns, cartridges, history, physics, epidemiology, anything firearm related...and you can spend hours in fascination at his depth of knowledge, and exuberance at just loving to share his knowledge. War is hell, but it is also the fabric of legends.

Truly makes one wonder of the reality, the depth, of human beings and their interactions with each other.

What is it about guns that we love so much?

We know it begins with equalization of force, but what is it now?

I believe that it will matter.

Do not ever give up your God given right to protect yourself.

But hey, I'm probably preaching to the choir.

Re: Looking for Ideal Firearm
 

[quote=Argentsum;1316274]Why not skip the low caliber stuff and try a pistol that shoots .825 G&S?

http://www.chuckhawks.com/825_magnum.htm


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Thats the best!

E-A